Free Mangastream

Submitted by SuperSaiyaMan on Sat, 02/11/2012 - 21:46
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Stop hogging things here. Mangastream gave us fast, accurate translations and we need it back. Why don't you try WORKING with them?

Comments

Submitted by ZEROINTELIGENCE on Sat, 02/11/2012 - 22:39

Dude, Mangastream's translations are shitty!! Why did you even post this here!?

Submitted by SuperSaiyaMan on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 00:33

You definetely live up to your screenname? Shitty? Its far better than Viz's translations.

I mean? Shadow Doppelganger instead of Shadow Clone? Shinra Tensei as All Mighty Push? Chibaku Tensei as Planetary Devastation?

Submitted by AmaranthSparrow on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 01:55

Shadow Doppelganger is actually an extremely accurate translation, even if it seems kinda weird at first.

Fun fact, here:

Believe it or not, the specific kanji used in Kage Bunshin no Jutsu for "bunshin", 分身, literally means "one's other self" or "body double".

It does NOT mean "copy" or "duplicate" or "clone".

When a Japanese person sees that kanji, they're generally thinking of a doppelganger. In fact, if you were to look up 分身 on the Japanese wikipedia, it automatically redirects to the Japanese article for "doppelganger".

If the original scanlations hadn't popularized "clone", I'd guess that nobody would bat an eyelash at it.

Almighty Push is also pretty much a PERFECT translation for Shinra Tensei. The kanji for the attack literally means, "Omnipresent God Heaven Push". Almighty is an English word that means both "god" and "omnipotent". Not only does it mean the same thing, it's worded very concisely, has a good ring to it, and can be dubbed without worrying about it not lipsynching properly.

Almighty Push and Universal Pull are two of my favorite attack name translations in the entire manga.

VIZ's translation for Chikabu Tensei in the manga is "Catastrophic Planetary Construction", which is a 100% accurate translation. Perhaps the only valid complaint would be that "tensei", 天星, can refer to any heavenly body (such as stars and moons), not just planets.

They changed to to "Planetary Devastation" in the anime for the sake of dubbing. The full translation has too many syllables, it wouldn't be possible to lip synch it in English. Same goes for some of their other translations.

I'd also like to point out that VIZ's manga usually translate attack names using both the Japanese and English. For example, the first time Pain used the attack, it was written as "Shinra Tensei! Almighty Push!!"

Now, that's not to say that VIZ's translations are always 100% perfect. But that's usually the case with any translation. Mangastream made many mistakes over the years that I noticed when I'd compare between Japanese and English.

If I read the original Japanese before the scanlation, I'm almost always unsatisfied with their translations). And a lot of scanlation groups are far worse than either of them.

VIZ makes mistakes now and then, but no more than any other scanlation group I've seen. And their overall quality is of a much more professional caliber, in terms of wording, realistic dialogue, and just generally using correct "comic book grammar", like translating the onomatopoeia (sound effects), or bolding important words to emphasize them.

Submitted by narutobleach16y... on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 13:13

How do you know all this

Submitted by AmaranthSparrow on Mon, 02/13/2012 - 00:01

I actually used to edit and help translate Naruto scanlations years ago (around 2007), and I still often read the Japanese spoiler scripts that are posted by Ohana and other people on the Japanese message board "ni-channel".

You could say that translating and learning about the etymology of words is sort of a hobby of mine.

Submitted by narutobleach16y... on Fri, 02/17/2012 - 20:48

I am impressed by your hobby! Too bad mangastream dropped shonen manga

Submitted by AmaranthSparrow on Sat, 02/11/2012 - 23:01

Mangastream's service constitutes copyright infringement. What they do is and always has been illegal. In the old days, scanlation groups would drop series that are licensed, out of respect to the creators. If you really like a series, you should support the creators by obtaining it legally so they actually make some money.

Online manga viewing websites are honestly the primary reason why the manga industry in the US has gone to hell. Tokyopop went out of business and Bandai no longer licenses their series overseas because piracy is so prevalent.

Also, while I appreciated their effort, mangastream's quality honestly hasn't been THAT great for quite a while now. Their translations aren't as good as they used to be, they make typos and errors from time to time, and their scans -- well, there's only so much that can be done with scans of cheaply printed WSJ issues.

Ever since WSJA came out, it's really made me realize how much better quality the official stuff is. Even if it's still not quite perfect, it's better than most of the fanmade stuff. About the only way WSJA could improve, IMO, is if it were slightly higher resolution, and if it came out even closer to the Japanese releases.

Submitted by KexCormacson on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 00:02

Keep in mind that sometimes, there's just no way to legally obtain certain things. Take REBORN!, for example. (I know, I know, I keep going on about this in every thread. But I'm voicing a legitimate complaint.)

Viz has licensed REBORN!, and forced MangaStream to take down all the chapters of REBORN! that they had. HOWEVER, it has been physically impossible to read any volumes past 16 in the US legally, and Viz has not shown any initiative in releasing recent chapters. How, I ask, are fans of REBORN! supposed to LEGALLY keep up with the series if Viz hasn't done anything with it in over two years?

Trust me, I'd LIKE to legally obtain and read REBORN!, and I'd love to read Hunter X Hunter as well, but it doesn't seem possible unless Viz does something. How was MangaStream's release of weekly chapters of REBORN! hurting Viz in any way? Simple answer: It wasn't. Viz was essentially hurting itself. And it's also hurting itself by having the chapters released in WSJA THREE WEEKS BEHIND JAPAN.

Rant over for tonight. I'm done venting.

Submitted by agila61 on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 08:57

If they focused on things like that, they'd not face 10% of the heat that they do. Heck, if they filtered IP addressed by country, redirected to the publisher's site for Japan addresses and redirected to a legit digital source for the series for countries that had a legit digital source, who'd bother them?

They don't do that, because if they did that they would not be as popular as a site that provided bootleg copies in competition with legit copies in the US, because they would be missing some of the most popular manga. And if they were not as popular their advertising would not generate as much money.

Submitted by VongolaNinja on Thu, 03/22/2012 - 18:06

I agree with you regarding Reborn!; as a big fan of the series, I was dismayed when they put the series on hiatus. However, to be fair, while they did not finish the Future arc in the manga (YET), they have subbed and put the entire anime on their vizanime website for people to view for free, with quality subs and better translations. Reborn! had the misfortune of being released during a time that Viz seemed to be their most zealous about censorship, especially regarding Naruto, One Piece, and the like; since then, they have improved drastically and with any luck, are thinking about giving Reborn! another chance.

After all, they subbed the anime and even forced Mangastream to take the manga off their website; with any luck, that means that they are planning to make a move regarding Reborn! soon, possibly adding it to Alpha, which has only actually been around for 3 months; with time, after testing the waters, more series will be added and the lag reduced.

Literally, I would love to have the Reborn! manga legally, physically, and on my bookshelf at home (and maybe some extra copies for my dorm room), but I think those will come in time and proving to Viz that there is a demand for it that will actually buy it and make the effort worthwhile.

Submitted by SuperSaiyaMan on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 00:42

You know, Viz wasn't losing any money due to Mangastream. Or One Manga. Or Mangatoshokan. Or any of the other manga sites that have been taken down. Arguing 'Copyright Infringement'-something that is decades out of date, something that refuses to grow and change with the times, doesn't help your argument.

Mangastream's scans have always been good, of extremely high quality.

You know what this site should do? Instead of making people pay their hand and feet to read outdated manga...they should start posting up to date. And post ADVERTISING to make it FREE.

Submitted by AmaranthSparrow on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 01:08

You think people in Japan get their manga for free? Weekly Shonen Jump costs money, you know. About $2.50 an issue, USD.

You can get Weekly Shonen Jump Alpha for $1 an issue, or 48 issues for just $25 a year. That's extremely affordable. If you want legal access to high quality translations of manga in an affordable bundle, just a couple weeks after release in Japan, this is what you *should* support. This is basically the iTunes of manga services.

Also Mangastream's scans are NOT that great of quality. They're scanned from a print magazine which is basically printed on recycled toilet paper to keep costs down. Their editors have to redraw it, blur it, blend it, and completely redo the halftones (waaay too dark, I might add) just to make it look halfway presentable. VIZ gets the pristine copies straight from Shueisha, in high quality.

Compare the image quality in Weekly Shonen Jump Alpha with any scanlator. It's far better.

And yes, VIZ and other English companies have lost money due to scanlators, specifically aggregate websites like mangastream. It was one thing ten years ago when scanlations were something you had to spend hours on IRC to find and download, but within the last several years, you can just type it into google and read a whole series online for free.

Why do you think companies like TokyoPop have started going out of business? Why do you think companies like Bandai have decided that they won't even offer their properties for licensing in the US?

Submitted by hayata123 on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 02:03

I would surely buy a subscription if this was available in my country! Lincenses only target USA and Canada! Even though i buy all the new tankobon versions of 4/6 series listed in shounen jump alpha, this deal is not available for my country! I would gladly support official licenses as i already do buy all the latests volumes. But why is this not available in my country. I hope sometime in the future they will release this worldwide!

Submitted by AmaranthSparrow on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 02:15

I agree, I hope it comes to your country eventually. If it's popular, I'm sure it will gain more interest internationally.

As for why it may or may not be available in your country, you can pretty much blame it on the governments and laws. International licensing and distribution can be extremely tricky, especially since some series may be owned by different license holders in different countries.

So, say if one company owns the rights to Naruto in Germany, and a completely different company owns the rights to it in Spain, negotiations and contracts would have to be established between all the different companies involved in order to release it across all of Europe.

Submitted by SuperSaiyaMan on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 00:35

Do you three above support SOPA, PIPA, and ACTA, other methods of suppressing free speech?

Submitted by AmaranthSparrow on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 00:47

No.

However taking someone else's work and reposting it on the internet for free, often before it's even available on newstands, is absolutely not "free speech". It's copyright infringement, plain and simple. If you're against SOPA and other acts only because you want to get stuff for free instead of paying for them like everyone else, then you're only in it for yourself, not for "free speech".

If you want to support scanlations and other similar forms of piracy, at least have the stones to come out and admit you're doing it illegally and for your own personal gain. Don't act like some white knight, pretending you're helping anybody but yourself.

And don't act like because a series isn't licensed for serialization in the US, you have the "right" to just steal your own copy off the internet, especially when you're probably getting it five days before people in Japan can even buy it.

Submitted by SuperSaiyaMan on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 00:52

Except it IS on Newstands in Japan.

Again, Copyright Infringement is an outdated system that needs to change. We're in the Internet Age now.

Submitted by agila61 on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 08:52

There's a difference between the details of how copyright is enforced and copyright itself. Copyright itself is a system developed two hundred years ago to protect the interests of artists and writers because steam printing presses made mass editions much easier and quicker to produce, and it was becoming impossible for the official print run to compete against pirate print runs that did not have to pay the artist or writer.

Protecting the right of the artists and writers to be paid for their work has not gone out of date because of the internet: if anything, the internet makes it even more urgent to protect those rights. As far as the threat to the ability of artists and writers to make a living, its like the upgrade to steam printing presses times a thousand.

That has nothing to do with SOPA/PIPA/ACTA or any of those bills written by the MPAA and RIAA. They are not designed to protect artists and authors, they are designed to protect the financial interests of big corporations, and they are wide open to massive abuse, when the MPAA has already shown that they are happy to abuse the system we already have.

All you have to do is to come up with and put into place another system that guarantees that the artists and authors of the original work get paid, and once you do that, we can retire the copyright system. Until then, stripping the rights of artists and authors to say who can copy their work and who cannot would be a gross abuse of those who do so much to make our lives better.

Submitted by SuperSaiyaMan on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 01:03

Disregard my comments. Please.

Submitted by ZEROINTELIGENCE on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 12:31

Looks like going straight into SJAlpha's forum was a bad idea. You now wonder why most of the people that agree with you are bitching in Facebook.

Next time, think. Especially think about the mangaka's drawing every week in Weekly JUMP.

People might read manga in a heartbeat but that doesn't mean mangakas are machines churning out manuscripts in seconds.

Submitted by narutobleach16y... on Sun, 02/12/2012 - 13:15

I converted my subcription to alpha yesterday but i cannot read the manga they promised me

Submitted by urian brown on Mon, 02/13/2012 - 10:51

Please email sjalpha@viz.com

They can help you out.

Thanks for subscribing!

Urian Brown - - Supreme King and Master of the Forums

Submitted by Zyx66 on Tue, 02/14/2012 - 16:35

You know, I totally agree that all these guys need to make money, but the thing that throws me off is that this is 3 weeks behind the actual chapters!! I mean if it was a week, I wouldn't mind it, but 3 weeks is too much of a wait for us fans!

Submitted by urian brown on Wed, 02/15/2012 - 11:05

From when Weekly Shonen Jump is available in stores in Japan.

To be clear.

Thanks for all the posts! I'm a firm believer in thoughtful debate. Even if it's heated. Passion is power!

Urian Brown - - Sage King of the Forums.

Submitted by KentaYuki on Sat, 03/17/2012 - 17:49

Woah! You guys are all like.... Anyways, I go on both sides: Mangaka's need to be respected along their works, and, true, it does feel easy to look up manga on the internet.
(This argument might never end at this point!)